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WASHINGTON (RNS) The Lutheran denomination that GOP presidential candidate Rep. Michele Bachmann quit in June sought to explain its belief that the papacy is the anti-Christ after reports questioned whether Bachmann is anti-Catholic. Six days before Bachmann officially launched her presidential campaign last month, the Minnesota Republican and her family left Salem Lutheran Church in […]

16 Comments

  1. Perhaps Bachmann should know the tenets of her faith, if she is going to play to that crowd. Since she hasn’t set foot in church for two years, mayhaps she ‘forgot’ that her sect hated Catholics. Big blunder on her part.
    Is anyone else exceedingly weary of these lying politicians with their pathetic lukewarm faith, pretending to be ‘good God-fearing folk’?
    Then again, she could study from our dear President how to play Christian when needed…. He has it down perfectly.

  2. This is akin to our fearless leader, Obama, who sat in a church riddled with hatred of America and rampant racism for 20 years, and then claimed he never heard any of it. In fact, he said that he considers the “Reverend” Wright a mentor. I am so tired of the perfidy and duplicity of politicians.

  3. Martin Luther added the word “alone” re faith alone. He added it to German translation of bible. Nowhere in the bible does it say by faith “alone” you are saved. The bible does speak of tradition. Peace.

  4. Catholics do not believe that we are saved by doctrine, but by obedience to God and that means faith and good works respond to the generosity of the cross. As far as papal infallibility goes, most Protestants are absolutely ignorant of what it really means: the pope is infallible only in matters of faith and morals and this only in official documents or with a council. These statements are in fact generally rare but significant. As far as so called evangelicals go: even the bible does not claim to have al the truth and it never says that one is saved only by faith…think about it….who saves?

  5. WELS is the third largest Lutheran denomination in the US, and while conservative, is quite mainstream. If Michelle Bachmann had been a member of any other Lutheran denomination, she would have been attacked on the same basis. And quite unfairly I might add.

  6. Riochard Mansfield

    I want Michele Bachmann for President of the US because I stand for all the points in her political platform – please see her personal blog. Everybody knows there is variation in the Catholic church viz prolife, family values – that is not the issue. The issue is translating family values in the political sphere, at a time when congress is trying to promote abortion through its health care insurance program, at the expense of US economy. Ideology appears to be trumping sound financial management at the moment and Michel Bachmann is showing us this fact honestly.

  7. I would invite that Lutheran church to read the Catechism of the Catholic Church and find out that they really shouldn’t have any objection to the Church’s teaching…and drop the ludicrous nonsense about the Catholic Church being the antichrist. That is just plain ridiculously silly. They are giving the heart of Christ tremendous grief by this calumny and division. If Christians would be united they would be a powerful force for good in the world.
    By the Way…The Catholic Church chose the Books to be compiled into what we now know as The Bible.

  8. This is nothing more than the typical self righteous protestant trash that is continually preached against the Catholic Church.

  9. These folks need to get a copy of the original text and a good translator. The word used to describe the Antichrist uses the pronound “he”. The word used to describe his kingdomnuses “it”. So the Antichrist is certainly a person.

  10. Rev. Robert Waters

    I invite Laurie to study the Canons and Decrees of the Council of Trent,which anathamatize the Lutheran and Pauline doctrine of justification and condemn those who believe it to hell. They are giving the heart of Christ tremendous grief by this calumny and division.

    I will be more charitable than Buzzy Gren, and not characterize the rulings of Trent as self-righteous Catholic trash. But I will point out that it is Lutheran belief that the doctrine anathamatized by Trent is in fact the central teaching of revelation, and lies at the heart of Christ’s purpose in becoming incarnate. One may disagree with that belief, but if one accepts it, the conclusion the Lutheran Confessions reach does not seem an unreasonable one.

    Tarik should be congratulated by pointing out that Catholics do indeed believe that we are saved, not by a faith which produces works, but by faith AND works. The Roman Catholic church continues to teach the Tridentine doctrine, which Lutherans believe conflicts with the very heart of revealed truth.

    I would point out that those responsible for the document known as the Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification lacked the authority to make their claim that the anathemas of Trent to not apply to Lutherans today stick. Indeed, in Catholic teaching, the decrees of Trent are infallible and unchangeable. And since the words “justification,” “grace,” and “faith” all have different meanings in Catholic and Lutheran theology, all the JDDJ actually accomplished was to adopt a formula both sides can agree on while disagreeing about what its words actually mean.

    Finally, Steve should be better informed as to the nature of apocalypic writings. Groups, movements and ideas are frequently symbolized as persons in Revelation and other such writings.

    In short, while I, too, may cringe a little at the suggestion that the Smalkald Articles’ statement that papacy is the antichrist of Revelation, Lutherans have no more reason to be embarrassed by that teaching than Catholics have by Trent’s. Yet I recall no such outcry when John Kerry ran for president. It would seem that a double standard is at work here.

  11. Christ the Lord chose 12 Apostles. Of these, one apostasised and Paul took his place. They have the Gift of the Holy Spirit, the original 11 from the Pentacost and Paul from the laying of the hands from Peter. This is called Apostolic Succession. Jesus’ Passion on the cross for all sins begot our sanctification from God the Father through the Holy Spirit. Christ’s Apostles and their chosen benefactors pass on this action of the Holy Spirit to all men. There are seven catholic rites that have claim to this succession, the Latin Rite in Rome being one. All others outside this succession have no claim for sanctifying grace. Baptism, scripturally accurate, can begot sanctifying grace, however, validation is recommended by an ordained priest. All sins after baptism must be absolved through Christ’s valid successors of His Apostles.

  12. Yes, Thomas. That is the circular argument by which the Roman Catholic church claims a unique position for the Roman Catholic church- sort of. The trouble is twofold: first, that it can’t be supported from the teachings of Christ and His apostles, but only from the assertions of the Roman Catholic church about its own specialness, and, secondly, that even in the eyes of the Roman Catholic church your restriction of sanctifying grace to the ministrations of ordained Catholic priests is dubious. See Vatican II’s Decree on Ecumenism.

  13. Oh, and Mea… Phillip Melanchthon more than adequately answered that bit about Luther having added “alone” to the Greek text when that rather weak argument was first made. Melanchthon in the Apology to the Augsburg Confession:

    The particle alone offends some, although even Paul says, Rom. 3:28: We conclude that a man is justified by faith, without the deeds of the Law. Again, Eph. 2:8: It is the gift of God; not of works, lest any man should boast. Again, Rom. 3:24: Being justified freely. If the exclusive alone displeases, let them remove from Paul also the exclusives freely, not of works, it is the gift, etc. For these also are [very strong] exclusives. It is, however, the opinion of merit that we exclude. We do not exclude the Word or Sacraments, as the adversaries falsely charge us. For we have said above that faith is conceived from the Word, and we honor the ministry of the Word in the highest degree. Love also and works must follow faith. Wherefore, they are not excluded so as not to follow, but confidence in the merit of love or of works is excluded in justification.

    Luther may have added the word “alone” to one particular passage, for the sake of clarity. But precisely faith alone is clearly and consistently what Paul taught whenever he discussed the subject, as can be readily seen simply by reading what he says about it elsewhere.

  14. Hey good Rev.Bobby Waters !

    You might care to check this out:

    Biblical Evidence for Catholicism:
    http://socrates58.blogspot.com/

    http://socrates58.blogspot.com/2005/04/is-lutheranism-officially-anti.html

    http://socrates58.blogspot.com/2005/12/council-of-trent-canons-on.html

    http://socrates58.blogspot.com/2006/11/salvation-justification-faith-alone.html

    Come over & debate us !

    If ur game that is ! :)

    Bring It On !