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For those who follow Jesus—actually taking his words to heart and do what he said—only one response seems possible, and it’s not gun control. It’s gun elimination. By Dan Webster.

64 Comments

  1. Dan, there is a lot here I agree with, but is it reasonable to consider that firearms used for hunting and / or sporting purposes present a different set of criteria?

    Not all gun-owners are violent, idolatrous Hestonites. Perhaps some distinction and nuance could be helpful, no?

  2. Jesus was not saying to get rid of “weapons”… he said, “put your weapons back where they belong”. He and the disciples were surrounded by Roman soldiers and guards!!! Jesus was telling his disciples they were in no circumstance that would allow a man to draw his sword and live. The apostles is lucky he got out alive as it was. Swords were used for protection and aggression. Bows and arrows at that time were used for hunting… and aggression.

  3. Kevin…yes, there is a distinction. But the number of gun related injuries and deaths each year is staggering due to a crime of passion because of easy access to a weapon. Dennis…let’s not forget about beating swords into ploughshares and spears into pruning hooks. The overwhelming evidence in the gospels is Jesus was a pacifist. And don’t quote me one passage of driving people out of the temple. If ever there was a time for Jesus to rally an armed insurrection it was at the feeding of the 5,000. But he didn’t. He sat down and had a meal for which he gave thanks, blessed and shared with everyone.

  4. Jesus might have said that, and yes he was not violent, but a perfect world with no violence is an impossible dream. Giving up guns will not stop anything, do you think Christians are the people committing these crimes? So why would Christians forfeiting guns help anything? Gun violence is an issue concerning the morals of America, not the guns themselves (couldn’t a killer end a person’s life with a car just as easily with a gun?), we have turned our backs on God, and with that we have slowly lost His hand of protection. You quoted the Bible but didn’t even look at the Old Testament.God ordered the slaying of an entire people (the Amalekites) by sword because of their evil deeds, David defeated Goliath with a sling and stone, and the Israelites defended themselves from enemies numerous times using weapons. Yes we are to love our enemies, but we can defend ourselves. I own numerous guns, go hunting regularly, and have been taught how to handle them properly; it is not people like me that use guns violently, it is people with no respect to God’s moral law. So do not use your first amendment right to threaten my second amendment right to defend myself.

  5. Oh my. Such ignorance of classical Christianity and its stipulations for self defense and just war (or professor Darrell Cole’s “Good War” theory). For now, this will have to do as a response:

    http://www.captainsjournal.com/2012/09/25/christians-the-second-amendment-and-the-duty-of-self-defense/

  6. Stephen Clark

    To remind Americans what Winthrop actually said: “Now the onely way to avoyde this shipwracke and to provide for our posterity is to followe the Counsell of Micah [Micah 6.8], to doe Justly, to love mercy, to walke humbly with our God, for this end, wee must be knitt together in this worke as one man, wee must entertaine each other in brotherly Affeccion, wee must be willing to abridge our selves of our superfluities, for the supply of others necessities, wee must uphold a familiar Commerce together in all meekenes, gentlenes, patience and liberallity, wee must delight in eache other, make others Condicions our owne, rejoyce together, mourne together, labour, and suffer together, allwayes haveing before our eyes our Commission and Community in the worke, our Community as members of the same body, soe shall wee keepe the unitie of the spirit in the bond of peace, the Lord will be our God and delight to dwell among us, as his owne people. … Hee shall make us a prayse and glory, that men shall say of succeeding plantacions: the lord make it like that of New England: for wee must Consider that wee shall be as a Citty upon a Hill, the eies of all people are uppon us [Matthew 5.14-16]; soe that if wee shall deale falsely with our god in this worke wee have undertaken and soe cause him to withdrawe his present help from us, wee shall be made a story and a byword through the world …till wee be consumed out of the good land whether wee are going: And to shutt upp this discourse with that exhortacion of Moses that faithfull servant of the Lord in his last farewell to Israell [Deuteronomy 30]. Beloved there is now sett before us life, and good, deathe and evill in that wee are Commaunded this day to love the Lord our God, and to love one another to walke in his wayes and to keepe his Commaundements and his Ordinance, and his lawes, and the Articles of our Covenant with him that wee may live and be multiplyed, and that the Lord our God may blesse us in the land whether wee goe to possesse it: But if our heartes shall turne away soe that wee will not obey, but shall be seduced and worshipp other Gods our pleasures, and proffitts, and serve them, it is propounded unto us this day, wee shall surely perishe out of the good Land whether wee passe over this vast Sea to possesse it; Therefore lett us choose life, that wee, and our Seede, may live; by obeyeing his voyce, and cleaveing to him, for hee is our life, and our prosperity. “

  7. Mr. Smith…the really classical Christianity is Jesus; his words and his actions. Christianity after Constantine brought us the crusades, the pogroms, and now the worship of America’s “divine anointing” as many would have believe as they wrap the flag around the cross. I think I know my history well enough to say Jesus would not be carrying a gun. All the evidence in the gospels is Jesus was a pacifist.

    • Jesus was not a pacifist, but preached that God’s kingdom would rid the world of the wicked and all badness. When this happens Jesus, as God’s installed King, will execute judgment against the wicked. Those not living in harmony with God’s will and purpose.

      Hardly a pacifist.

    • What Jesus taught his followers was not to fear men and to be faithful to God who, in his due time, will set things right & resurrect his faithful worshippers.

      Even DEATH will yield to God Almighty, ‘And the meek and upright shall inherit the earth.’ -Psalms

  8. Dan,

    You make category errors (regarding the behavior and mission of Christ compared to God’s expectations for His people in interpersonal relationships and at the state level) because you lack rules for hermeneutics. I’ll cover more about this later in another commentary.

    But regarding commentaries, you didn’t read mine, did you? You claim to know history, but your version is contrary to the facts, contrary to the church fathers, and contrary to the actions of Christ Himself.

    As for God’s expectations for you versus your own fabricated views, this is as good a summary as any right now:

    “God has laid the expectations at the feet of heads of families that they protect, provide for and defend their families and protect and defend their countries. Little ones cannot do so, and rely solely on those who bore them. God no more loves the willing neglect of their safety than He loves child abuse. He no more appreciates the willingness to ignore the sanctity of our own lives than He approves of the abuse of our own bodies and souls. God hasn’t called us to save the society by sacrificing our children or ourselves to robbers, home invaders, rapists or murderers.”

    You don’t believe in self defense because you don’t see man as made in God’s image, and/or you don’t care for the little ones. They look to you for protection, and you dream wildly about social engineering programs (for which God has NOT made you responsible) rather than sit with them safely at your feet as did Christ.

    Think of the children. Rapists, abusers, murderers and kidnappers all have designs on their lives. It is your duty to protect them. DUTY. Not a choice, not an option. Duty.

    • Mike Armistead

      Herschel, That is an excellent quotation that you cite about the defense of children. Where is that taken from? Thanks for adding your calm responses to this discussion. The original article is very narrow in its argument. Dan Webster may choose to be a pacifist, but he greatly underestimates humanity’s propensity for evil. Any lunatic who steals weapons legally owned and rightly used by law-abiding citizens is not going to amenable to chats about “conflict resolution” when he goes off his rocker and wants to destroy people for some halucinatory reason. Some nations are just as bad. Not all Christians are so naive about protecting themselves, their families, their communities, and their countries. If we are going with total pacificism, that means the disbanding of all police forces and armies that protect us enemies domestic and foreign. The only thing evil understands is righteouse force. Just as God gave our bodies an immune system to fight off all outside assualts that would destroy us, so our societies have to develop an immune system to ward off the human cancers and viruses that seek to attach us and take us down.

  9. False christians will do anything to hang onto their weapons. Why? Because false christians do not have God’s Spirit and do not have REAL faith in Christ or the resurrection. They also do not have faith in the false doctrine that they would go to heaven. If they truly believed this lie, they wouldnt be so afraid of death. Heaven is the ultimate goal isnt it? But no. False christians do not have faith in going to heaven, (a false doctrine anyway) or in the resurrection.

    They are part of the world. Continuing to put their trust in mans governments and their weapons. Continuing to support false hopes that the USA is somehow a “chosen nation” to God when the bible CLEARLY doesnt support this view. Its no wonder so many people hate “christians”. They are hypocrites and BARELY know what the bible REALLY teaches. The scripture they DO KNOW, is taken out of context and twisted to fit their own unseen wickedness.

  10. You don’t care about the children either, do you Jay? What would you do if a home invader entered your home and took your child into slavery (it happens more than you think). Would you choose to protect your child with a weapon, any kind of weapon – hands, baseball bat or whatever – or would you willingly sit by and say, “sorry kid, see ya’ in Heaven, if that false doctrine is actually real!?”

    If so, what you’re advocating is panamount to child abuse, and you ought to see it as such. Or would you use your hands or a kitchen knife to defend your children, Jay? I’m waiting.

    • I do not condone abuse of ANY sort. And i fully support the right of ANY father (as I am one) to use whatever means necessary to defend his family against attack. Example, My father once defended our family from attack with the use of a gun. So you cannot TELL me that i do not care for children or their safety because I do.

      Secondly it is when someone lives by Bible principle that they realize that instruments of DEATH are just NOT compatible with true christianity. Therefore a TRUE christian would find it hard to reconcile owning a gun, but would take whatever means necessary to PREVENT horrible things from happening to his family.

      The reality is based on scripture is that “Time and unforeseen occurrance befall us all” No matter how much of an arsenal you have, it cannot protect you from everything.

      I have lost people i love from gun violence on both sides of the law. I have faith that Christ is the resurrection and my loved ones will rise again. Still, those who choose to take up arms in this system will have to answer to God in the end.

      • I used to be a church going Christian and I can tell you as a crime victim also that just because you “do everything you can” to protect your family does not mean trouble will not come looking for you. Guns are a tool and nothing more and Christians are not just looking for a way to keep guns. A man who cannot be equal to a criminal in strength when a criminal comes calling will have nothing he can do but beg in a time of trouble. It would be great if we could all be peace makers and expect peace as a result, but the school kids who have been killed were in school, not looking for trouble. Trouble came looking for them and because someone thought they were being morally superior by keeping guns out of schools the kids have died by the hundreds. Yeah, Christians would like to live in a world where there is no evil, but evil dominates this world and being empty handed because you think you are doing God’s will is nothing more than burying your head in the sand and pretending it’s enough. War exists, poverty and crime exists. Sadly, that’s how it is. A person, Christian or not, must be equal to an attacker if he hopes to survive, and nothing is equal to a criminal with a gun besides a man with a gun. Try and use your faith, he will laugh at you. You think some of those kids were not praying when they died? In this world people must be able to fight against evil, and like it or not, the only thing that will stop an armed criminal is an armed defender.

    • That said, in case you could not discern, I put my trust in the Almighty and choose not to take up arms. I would do all i could to follow Jesus words to pray for my enemies and trust in God that He’ll know I put faith in Him.

      I dont have a death wish OR wish for anyone of my family to be harmed by a gun, but through my relationship with God I am not afraid of this wicked world.

      As the Apostles said, “God is our helper, what can man do to us?”

      Dying loyal to God is better than living in cowardice.

      • Owning a gun is not cowardice. I have been face to face with two people who wanted to do me serious harm. No amount of talk was going to dissuade them, but when they found out I had a revolver, it was enough to make them leave me alone. So I would take it from your post that your belief is those of us who don’t just pray about it but decide to fight back are cowards? I wonder how the people in Colorado and the people at Luby’s in Texas would feel about that.

    • “Thou shalt not kill”

      Satan said-
      “Skin in behalf of skin, and EVERYTHING a man has he will give in behalf of his soul.”

      Everything including his integrity. People are willing, instead of trusting in God, the break every commandment in order to save their lives. To live in a world that is lying in the power of the wicked one.

      Thats NOT real faith.

      • So you believe that if you are threatened with mortal danger the true Christian just lets himself be killed and prays but does not fight back?? Wow. So you must believe that the kids shot up in the schools AND THE CHURCHES were all atheists or not praying hard enough. Tellya what, if the thug ever confronts my family again with lethal intentions, I will sling lead at him and have no problem taking responsibility for defending my home.

  11. Jay, this is progress. I think that you’re unnecessarily conflicted. On the one hand you say that a man should use whatever means necessary to defend his family, and on the other hand, you find it hard to reconcile a Christian owning a gun.

    Which is it? How do you go through life willingly accepting contradictions in your mind (some would call it “noetic structure”)? Is that okay with you? is it okay to hold propositions that are mutually exclusive and contradictory?

    Would you defend your family with your hands or a kitchen knife, but not a gun? Then you are willingly accepting that your weapons will be inferior to the criminal’s weapons, and thus, you are relegating your children to being victims. If not, if you would in fact use a firearm and find this an appropriate means of defense of the family, then why do you find it hard to reconcile a Christian owning a firearm?

    I think you have some basic and fundamental issues with which to contend. Your contention isn’t with me. It is within your own soul.

    • No. I think you misunderstood me. I support ANY man in defending his family. As for me an mine i would do whatever I could to take preventative measures to protect my family from harm while NOT placing myself in a situation where I would have to take a life.

      IF i were in that situation My faith would be primarily in God’s saving power while at the same time doing whatever i could NOT to let my child become a victim. How that would play out, no one can accurately say.

      IN the end though, as i stated from the scriptures, “Time and unforeseen occurance befall us ALL.” It may be that IF i were in that situation and my child or I lost our lives, it would be unavoidable.

      Many innocents lose their lives for thousands of reasons. We never know when it could happen or why. My point is, that the taking up of arms isnt compatible with the True Christianity.

      “A slave of the Lord does not need to fight, but needs to be gentle toward all, qualified to teach, keeping himself RESTRAINED UNDER EVIL, instructing with mildness those not favorably disposed; as perhaps God may give them repentance.” 2Tim 2:24,25

    • Answering AGGRESSION with VIOLENCE more often then not ESCALATES an already bad situation.

      If you indeed believe yourself to be a christian, you would come to know real peace and security. The world is wicked, that cant be argued, but those who have real faith can conquer the world. The things I speak of are the deep things of God. I do not expect you to understand in the pages of a blog. I will suggest that you pray and ask God to help you. If you truly have a sincere and humble heart, he will let himself be found by you.

      Violence, guns, even knives and swords… These are not the answer or the way to salvation.

      • Please give me one single example of a school or church where the people simply prayed and the gunman walked away. I can give you many examples of people dying as they prayed. Your prayer is not going to cause a bolt of lightning to come in and zap a thug in your home with a pistol intent on killing you. That is reality, Period.

  12. Jay,

    You did it yet again, and I didn’t in fact misunderstand you. You said:

    “As for me an mine i would do whatever I could to take preventative measures to protect my family from harm … ”

    And then:

    ” … taking up of arms isnt compatible with the True Christianity.”

    So, Jay. Is it whatever you can (you said, “whatever I could”) do to protect your family, or is it refusing to take up arms because that isn’t compatible with your faith?

    Let’s disavow you of the silly, peurile, childish notion once and for all that you can decide the situation, e.g., you will protect your children but not take a life. You don’t have this choice, and the notion that you will, or do, or can force the circumstances to fit your narrative, is just wrong-headed. You’re creating the narrative to keep from answering the hard questions. In your world, you get to have it both ways and hold to contradictory propositions. In mine, I don’t. I don’t allow myself to be so comfortable, and I won’t allow myself to believe contradictions.

    So will you use a weapon to defend your family, and did your father do so, and would you sin if you did, and did your father commit sin? Or would you willingly relegate your children to the status of victims of crimes?

    You must decide. Your narrative is fake, and you cannot force fit the circumstances.

    • Oh as as for what my father did in using a gun when he defended our family. Was it a sin? I dont believe so. A father is supposed to care for and protect his family. Thankfully no one was killed. That would be a sin that he wouldve had to live with.

      In the end though, my father has passed away and the scriptures reassure us that once dead, a person is acquitted of his sins.

      Finally this statement:
      “Your narrative is fake, and you cannot force fit the circumstances.”

      Is remarkably short sighted. We are speaking in “WHAT IFS”, so of course I cannot tell you what would actually happen in any given situation of danger. I can only speak on my continued effort to be Christ-like instead of following the pattern of this wicked world.

    • “In your world, you get to have it both ways and hold to contradictory propositions.”

      This is also an erroneous statement. No one gets to have it both ways. I am well aware of that. Like i said, Ive lost loved ones to gun violence on BOTH sides of the law.

  13. So will you use a weapon to defend your family, and did your father do so, and would you sin if you did, and did your father commit sin? Or would you willingly relegate your children to the status of victims of crimes?

    I would not ever own a gun. I would use a weapon if need be but not with the intend of taking a life. For defensive purposes OR if possible to defuse the situation. If I were out gunned, as it were, I would do my best to find another solution to whatever evil had befallen my family, even sacrificing myself.

    I do feel in an instance if my child were threatened I would naturally react and step between the assailant and my boy in order to protect him.

    Like i said. I dont expect you to understand the deep things IM speaking of above. You, just like the rest of this world, deal in “absolutes” because THIS LIFE is all you can see. I feel sorry for you and understand why Jesus felt such pity for those lost in his day.

  14. You still want to control the narrative Jay and create false circumstances. If you’re dead, you cannot defend your family. Sacrificing yourself does no good whatsoever. None. In whose world would such a thing happen? In what world would a kidnapper kill you and then decide that he’d had enough and that his prize worth hundreds of thousands of dollars on the open market was irrelevant? Seriously?

    And then next, you would use the gun (that you have said was incompatible with the Christian faith anyway) but use it so wisely and circumspectly that you didn’t take a life and knew you wouldn’t from the beginning? You would actually pull the trigger but know beforehand that you would’t take a life?

    Seriously? Are you listening to yourself? What would you do if you stepped between an assailant and your son to protect him? Would you use your hands to defend your son, or would you just stand there and allow a criminal to kill you and then take your son? Would you allow a criminal to render your wife a widow and your child fatherless by just standing there? Does your wife know this about you? Where does this find acceptance in Biblical law? Why do not not have any more respect for the fact that you are created in God’s image? Where does this low view of yourself come from? Not from the Holy Scriptures.

    • Well OBVIOUSLY if im dead i cant DO anything. Thats I would TRY and defuse the situation as best as i could without resorting to killing someone. In the end if it came DOWN to me having to kill someone, then so be it. But it would NOT be my first option.

      Again, youre speaking in absolutes. Your answer is to violence is immediate escalation of violence. I dont believe that is the answer to the worlds problems.
      I have a very high respect for life and that we ARE created in God’s image. I do not have a low image of myself at all. Life is a precious gift that should be defended, but at the same time, whether it be through persecutions, murder, hate, whatever, I have faith in God that If i lost my life DEFENDING my family, that THAT is acceptable in His sight.

      Im beginning the think you imagine Id just stand there and let bad things happen. This is NOT the case.

    • Maybe you should try reading more about Jesus teaching and the practical wisdom handed down by his apostles. That will hopefully help you understand Bible principle on how to react to evil in this world.

      You my friend are obviously a VERY SCARED person. And that plain to see.

  15. Okay. It’s take a long time to get to this point, but you’re settling the contradictions in favor of self defense and defense of the family. Very well. All the talk about first options, escalations, and so on, or just so much smoke. They cloud the issue I am trying to deal with.

    Now. What we have learned is that you would raise your hand to an assailant, or in other words, you would strike an assailant with your hand. I assume that because you would choose to do this, you do not see it as sinful.

    Very well. You are aware, aren’t you, that you could kill someone by striking them with your hands? And tell me please, what is the difference between using your hands and using a baseball bat or crow bar or kitchen knife?

    Distinguish between weapons, if you will. You have now included hands as an allowable weapon. Is there anything else?

    • And just so you know when i say that i support a man defending his family, that includes preventative defenses. Extra security or leaving a danger zone, having secure locations away from home, having bug out plans, building a community of others who are likeminded who can be of assistance… etc etc..

  16. Hersch,
    Anything can be used as a weapon. If this issue is about GUNS, you seem to forget that a GUN is ALWAYS a weapon.

    It serves no other purpose. I am VERY well aware that you can kill someone just by striking them. I used to study martial arts. But i began to recognize that violence is something God hates. In ALL forms.

    Any one of us can be victims of violence at any time. My point is NOT living in fear of what MIGHT happen and reacting in a Christ-like manner.

    Youre trying to prove a point that i clearly agree with. That IF i found myself in a situation where i had to fight for my family’s lives, i WOULD, but ONLY IF it boiled down to that happening.

    But before it GOT to that point, i would do ALL i could to remove my family from the danger. Ive already stated that i support a man defending his family. I dont see how you missed that.

  17. Jay, you just simply MUST deal with the contradictions in your own soul. Either a gun is an acceptable weapon or it is not. You started this exchange saying that owning one is incompatible with Christianity. You have ended allowing hands and even guns for self defense.

    And then yet, you still say that God hates violence in all forms. Does He? Does He hate the violence you have to perpetrate in the defense of your own family or yourself when an assailant comes towards you in a parking lot after using a cash machine? Does He hate it when you strike this person with your hands? Many people have been killed for $50, Jay. Giving a criminal your money doesn’t buy you anything, most of all, your life.

    Does God hate the violence when a nation goes to war to defend its borders from invasion? If He does, then He has given no authority or responsibility of a nation to defend its people. But then, what would we make of Paul’s stipulations on the power of the sword in Romans 13?

    You still have many issues to think about, Jay.

    • I see what youre saying. And yes God hates violence in ALL forms. God however is not the cause of the violence that mankind wreaks on each other. That bible also says that “God takes no pleasure in the destruction of the wicked” (paraphrase) That being when he meets out judgment.

      The sad fact is that the world we live in is indeed violent. My point is that violence only begets more violence. Self defense in indeed a form of violence, but while it may save your life, that doesnt mean that God looks on with a smile of approval. More likely He is saddened that mankind has to resort to such things AT ALL.

      The bottom line to everything is, is simply that no matter what hurtful things or defensive things mankind does to each other, it will NEVER solve the problems.

      IN the end, God’s kingdom will finally put an end to ALL wickedness and those who did not pursue violence will live in peace.

    • There are all kinds of issues that one could argue about in todays modern world. The bottom line there is how a Christian live his life and how strong his faith in God is. Obviously you have much to learn about the “quiet and mild spirit”.

      Things will get worse my friend. I hope you are able to handle whats coming in these final part of the days. Peace.

  18. AHA.. I see the disconnect in this conversation. You are arguing for guns in the EXTREME, while I am arguing against guns in whats MORE LIKELY to happen.

    In your view, you create the WORST CASE SCENARIO and then challenge that a gun is the best defense. IN that argument, youre likely right. But in REALITY, the national debate isnt about HIGHLY UNLIKELY crazy kidnapping home invasions. Its about guns in school and other public places.

    Another FACT is that many if not MOST shootings at home are either ACCIDENTAL or DOMESTIC.

  19. Not at all. I decided to do a search on the key words “home invasion” in Google news one day, and found more so many articles from around the country that I couldn’t link and post on all of them. I did it another day, and the same thing happened.

    There is a trend where criminals are using multi-man techniques for home invasions now, increasing their chances of success against the occupiers of the domicile. Simply allowing the home invasion team to do what they wanted doesn’t work. It leads in many cases to kidnapping, rape, and in one recent case, the victim being set on fire and burned. It’s horrible reading, but it happens all across America, every day.

    I have documented 2-, 3-, 4- and 5-man home invasions all over America, and also documented cases where having weapons stopped the home invasion and protected the family. I have co-workers who sustained a home invasion, and he and his wife are dead now, with their daughter fatherless and motherless. My own son, before he was a Marine, had a home invasion and had to deal with it using a shotgun.

    http://www.captainsjournal.com/2012/12/14/what-was-that-about-not-needing-a-high-capacity-magazine/

    Highly unlikely is not at all an accurate characterization. That’s a lie, even if unintentional. And the point isn’t what you would attempt to do first, or second, or third, before you resorted to a weapon.

    At issue is whether Christ is really a pacifist and whether it is evil to defend yourself with all means possible. Advocates of the notion that Christ was a pacifist cannot deal with contradictory notions from the balance of Biblical law where heads of households are responsible to provide security for their families. They must see the Bible as a hodge-podge of contradictory ideas, picking and choosing which one they like the best when they happen to like it, and jettisoning the rest when they happen to need to.

    This is modern American Christianity as we know it today. Silly, isn’t it? It is a free-for-all hermeneutic nightmare, with inductive Bible studies convincing everyone that every idea is correct and equally important, every interpretation is the right one, or the wrong one, depending upon whether the leader happens to be a throwback to the 1980′s hippie movement or something else.

    In the end, if there are 100 interpretations of a passage, 99 of them are wrong because they are contradictory. Perhaps all 100 are, but everything cannot be correct. Only one view is correct in order to be logical.

    And in this case, murder isn’t acceptable, while killing in self defense is. We must distinguish, categorize, parse, use proper hermeneutics and be systematic in our theology. And we must see God’s heart through His law. We cannot throw the dice and get good interpretations of the Holy Scriptures. We may as well be palm readers and look at tea leaves.

    Far from prohibiting self defense, the Bible demands self defense because man is created in God’s image. God doesn’t hate defense of yourself or the little ones. He would hate it if you stood idly by and did nothing. Cowards do that. Christians put themselves in harm’s way to protect and defend. Anyone who doesn’t see it that way doesn’t see it through God’s eyes.

    • Bryce Tearney

      Actually I know many, Muslims who think like this. I am just making that observation. I know many that say oeople should kill in self-defense. Sometimes they decide bombing is self-defence too. It is very much in the Koran I think I have heard and read. Is it more Islamic or Christian or both?

  20. Jay, I want you to know that I sincerely appreciate your honest, open and candid exchange with me. It wasn’t merely an academic exercise. I consider this sort of thing to be very important, and you were willing to open your heart to me.

    I appreciate and won’t forget it.

  21. In this article MT5:43-45 and MT26:52 were quoted. Please read 2TIM2:15. You will see that there are divisions in the Word and they need to be properly divided. MT, MK, LK, and JN were books written about Jesus Christ coming to be King of the Jews. The church age wasn’t even born yet. What you are reading in MT5 is the constitution of the kingdom of heaven during the millenial reign. A kingdom that would have come if Christ would have been accepted. Instead He was crucified. He would have returned if they would have accepted the Holy Ghost instead of stoning Stephen (Acts7)(this is why Stephen saw Christ standing-Christ was ready to return). Instead it was a three-fold rejection. The rejection of John the Baptist (Father). Rejection of Christ (Son). Rejection of Stephen (Holy Ghost). THEN came the church age. Romans is the first book in the bible that is DIRECTLY to the church. Trying to draw church age doctrine from the OT or MT,MK,LK,JN will lead you down the wrong road. You will end up quoting verses about God ordering the destruction of the Amelkites. We (the church) are in a different dispensation. We are in the church age and are free by grace. Free from the law. But we should not use that freedom to sin (GAL5:13). Work out your own salvation. To defend your life? Work it out with God. As for me, I know that God blessed this country when it was founded. They were called Freemen. They had rights to guns. And the responsibility that came with them. Take away freedom and responsibility and you will be enslaved.

  22. Then it will be the next team’s turn for a new set of stories. Dark – Hebrews 12:1 says this: “Let us throw off everything that hinders us and the sin that so easily entangles us and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us. Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.

  23. A ban on guns is just like prohibition–a manifestation of the ancient heresy of Manicheanism which is in the US DNA through it’s Cavinistic roots. Sin does not reside in a creature either natural or manufactured but in the heart of man. A ban is just another flight from personal responsibility and the cosequences of one’s deeds, both here and in eternity.

  24. “God hates guns, period. They are satans toy. They are evil and unholy in every way. Every time a bullet flies and kills or mames, satan is laughing with delight. The NRA and christain right are furthering satans agenda by defending guns. When did guns become a christain value? Non violence is truly the way of Jesus, Ghandi, MLK & Lennon and they died by and for it. Please don’t involve me in your second amendment madness.

    • Your comment makes me angry. Guns are a method of protecting yourself and your home. Armed thugs are Satans playingthings and when people are so busy twisting the bible up to say what they want it amuses him to watch innocent people die. The death of the innocent is a sweet smell to the evil. I personally cannot imagine sitting around watching my wife or daughter raped or murdered while I sat around with no way of fighting back thinking that their screams made me a righteous person. If you ever faced an armed predator you will get a chance to see how righteous you feel then. I have faced a man with a car who wanted to run me down and a man with a nine millimeter, both times displaying my weapon and they backed off because I was equal to them. If I had it to do again I would do it. Satan laughs when evil prevails, my friend.

  25. Bryce Tearney

    From some comments far earlier why is there a goal to have someone say “ok I’ll have or use a gun then” why is that so important and Biblical. Hopefully I will be dead soon. The world would be far better off without me and I have never done anything illiegal other than jaywalking or going a few miles over the speed limit but I think the world would be far better off without me. And I am sure that some of these wonderful, devout Christians will show their true Christian sentiments that if I feel that way then I best kill myself. Christ would say that right? If I feel worthless then I am no good so just end it. I think that must be in the Bible or it was meant to be if it was not.

    • So explain to me why the Christians in the schools, the theatres and the restraunts were shot down. Was that somehow God’s will? I cant wrap my mind around the “empty hands are more righteous than armed ones” approach. I have never heard of one single person praying their way out of that situation and even if it had happened it did not do any of those victims any good, did it?

  26. Robert Slusser

    When Jesus prepared to send out his disciples prior to his crucifixion, he told them to take all necessary items for their journey including money, a knapsack and even a sword. And if they had no sword they were instructed to sell their cloak to procure a sword. I believe Jesus has given us all responsibilities according to our calling and some of us are called to protect our loved ones. I am a former Marine and have formerly worked for years in a state prison; interacting daily with all manner of men, some of whom have no problem with harming innocent men, women or even children. I have seen men take a straight razor to another man and cut him so severely that we all assumed the man would die (thank God that he lived). About ten years ago, on a nice summer afternoon, my wife answered a knock at the back porch door. It was a long-haired disheveled man who was talking about “They were after him” and he insisted that he use our phone. I grabbed my pistol before I went outside to talk to him at which time I noticed that he had a large knife that he was holding partially hidden in a long sleeve shirt. He refused to drop the knife and I yelled to my 18 year old daughter to call the police. We continued to talk as I walked backwards toward the street and in about 5 minutes the police arrived, screeching to a halt with guns drawn and shielded by their doors. I threw up my hands and yelled to them that the man had a knife up his sleeve. They ordered him to drop it but he would not and I was afraid that he was going to be shot but the officers were able to wrestle the knife from him. I still had my pistol under my t-shirt and never had to draw it or mention it to the police. But just having it allowed me to have the confidence that this man was never going to get into our house with my wife and daughter. I generally do not carry my pistol for carry everyday for several reasons. This is still a fallen world we live in and we are responsible for trying to spread the gospel of peace but I believe there is ample evidence from scripture for our defense of innocent life and self-defense.

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